“Look, I’m sure you’re nice and not creepy and all…”

posted in: NoMa | 12
Photo by Shutter Bug Chef

I was walking a friend’s dog while he was out of town when a guy on a bike stopped next to me and asked me a few questions about the dog, which made me wary, but all in all, was no big deal so I engaged him. Presh golden lab, by the way.

Then he switched into questions about where I lived (I gave a vague “around here”), my name (gave a fake one), and what I did. It would have been awkward for me to leave, because 1) the dog was um, doing it’s business; and 2) I wasn’t exactly going to run away with the dog. It was the middle of the day, moreover, and I had a dog with me, so I felt relatively safe, just creeped out.

Then the dude asked “Can we be friends?” I responded, “Um, I don’t normally make friends with people I don’t know.” He gave me some crap about “But we could get to know each other and be friends!” I told him that no, I wasn’t interested in “being his friend,” nor was I going to give him my number, as he had requested.

He looked positively insulted that I wouldn’t give him my number or agree to be friends with him, and asked why not.

I thought about giving him some b.s. reason (e.g., “I have a boyfriend,”) but I figured that after years of street harassment and being cornered by “polite” men on the street who apparently don’t care or don’t know that they’re intimidating, honesty was the best policy.

I told him “Look, I’m sure you’re nice and not creepy and all, but lots of creepy men have approached me on the street in the past, and I don’t KNOW that you aren’t creepy or a rapist. I’m not saying you ARE, but I’m just saying I DON’T KNOW. So, maybe you should stay stuff to guys you see hollering at women on the street, because the less of that shit that happens, the more apt you are to be able to approach women in public without them immediately getting their guard up.”

He looked like he had never previously considered this possibility.

Blowing his mind felt nice.

Submitted by anonymous on 7/19/2011

Location: NY Ave area subdivisions

Time of harassment: Day Time (9:30A-3:30P)

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12 Responses

  1. B.

    Sounds like you handled that perfectly– Bravo!

    You’ve inspired me. I never know how to handle those situations where they’re not being overtly menacing. I’m definitely going to use this approach in the future, so thanks!

  2. E.

    “maybe you should stay stuff to guys you see hollering at women on the street, because the less of that shit that happens, the more apt you are to be able to approach women in public without them immediately getting their guard up.””

    Yeah, this has nothing to do with “hollering” at women. Obviously he was doing it wrong and no amount of behaviour by OTHER men would have changed your lack of interest/attraction to him.

    You weren’t interested but used to opportunity to excoriate a stranger about street harassment when it’s quite obvious from this story he wasn’t “holllering” or sexually harassing you at all. he just sounds like a nerd who can’t talk to women.

  3. Erin

    That’s such a great response! I’m going to file that away for future use.

    And it just shows how blind to/ignorant of the harassment that some men are! Hopefully, it was a learning moment for him.

  4. Anonymous

    Sounds like a typical human being trying, to the best of their ability, to be friendly to someone they don’t know. Hello! What’s your name? Where are you from? What do you do for a living? Just trying to meet someone new. Poor guy didn’t know he was talking to damaged goods.

    Maybe the men in this town, and in general, would treat women with more respect if women didn’t pounce on every chance they get to treat men like sub-human pieces of sh*t.

    Do you really think he “learned his lesson” because you indirectly, but hostile, called him a creepy rapist for simply trying to talk to you?

    I guarantee you all he learned is that trying to have a normal conversation with a woman in this town just isn’t worth it. Grats on helping to create another man in DC who feels that cat-calling from a distance or hiring by the hour are the only safe ways to interact with members of the opposite sex.

    • Ashley

      Anonymous, you’re a coward. The fact that you took the time to write all these belittling comments on everyone’s posts show that you are a bitter person (I’m going to go out on a limb and say that you’re a male.) Lol! Someone standing up for herself and saying she doesn’t “want to be friends” with a total stranger is “treating men like sub-human pieces of sh*t.” Really? Who cares if he was just trying to meet someone new. She didn’t want any part of it and he didn’t respect that.

    • B.

      Anonymous: There are several aspects of your post that are unsettling, but the one that struck me the most was this line:

      “Grats on helping to create another man in DC who feels that cat-calling from a distance or hiring by the hour are the only safe ways to interact with members of the opposite sex.”

      –So essentially, you are saying it’s our fault. Cat calling and prostitution are the fault and direct result of women not responding to men who want to hit on them, is that correct?

      Wow, ladies– Take note! Anonymous has taught us all something very important! Maybe if we would just start letting any man who wants to hit on us do so, no matter what the tactic, it would eradicate the incidence of cat-calling!

      Thank you, Anonymous, for schooling us on the underlying roots of street-harassment and cat calling.

      For the record, men do not cat-call from afar because they’ve given up on approaching women respectfully. Men cat-call from a far as a form of bullying, not because it feels like a safe way to interact with women.

      This line of reasoning is so utterly backwards, and totally in line with victim-blaming culture.

      You have some things to learn.

  5. Omega

    Anonymous, I bet a few stories in this blog are probably about you. You really need help …. just saying.

  6. cathy

    dear anonymous, men need to learn how to talk to women without pressing for more information than they have a right to. you’re clearly not really reading this entry or others for what we have to say, you’re simply defending the status quo wherein women are obliged to men’s feelings and not vice versa.

    talk to the women in your life, and really listen. you’ll see.

  7. Anonymous

    At the potentiality of feeding the Troll, I must say: Anonymous @ 1:52 pm, your ignorance is astounding. I might even think that it was purposeful.

    Anyway, I have seen MANY men use the line, “we could get to know each other and be friends…,” and none of them were nerds who couldn’t talk to women. All of them were trying to play on the perceived “innocence” or emotional sympathies of their victims/targets to try to get them to trust them. Most made it obvious that they were sexually attracted to the women. Some even used aggressive body language or “trapped” the women in subway or bus seats.

    That line, the asking of the number and being insulted at not receiving the “correct” response are signs that this man was “hollering.”

    • notled

      Not sure why this didn’t show up as mine, but it is.

  8. B.

    For weeks now, I’ve been trying to figure out exactly why E. and Anonymous’ comment didn’t sit well with me. Because I couldn’t quite articulate it, I refrained from responding to them.

    And then I had an experience waiting at my bus stop over the weekend, and I was finally able to articulate PRECISELY why I found both their reactions so unsettling.

    E., Anonymous: Let me begin by saying that I honestly do empathize with men and how difficult it must be to approach women they are interested in. I come from a family of all brother syblings, and it’s something we discuss and they consult me on frequently.

    Perhaps this is why part of me could understand where your comments, though misguided, were coming from.

    But at the end of the day, this is what it ultimately boils down to: In my experience, and in the experience of nearly every woman I know? Men who approach us just wanting to “be friends” are never JUST interested in being our friends. They are interested in more than that. They know it, and we know it. Let’s be honest.

    Furthermore, there’s something called intuition. Whether or not this experience sounded like anything more than “a typical human being trying, to the best of their ability, to be friendly to someone they don’t know”, or “just a nerd who can’t talk to women,” something in this posters gut told her it was more than that, and she reacted accordingly because that “something more” was not welcomed by her. As women, we are conditioned all our lives to be polite and disregard our gut feelings if those gut feelings go against being polite. And that has repeatedly put us in danger. A woman’s intuition should not be challenged, nor should it be criticized or dismissed. –Especially those women who have experienced enough harassment to have now developed a very, very strong instinct about these types of situations. (And it sounds like this poster is one of those women.)

    –I am one of these women: I have experienced an extreme amount of harassment in this area, ranging everywhere from pushy “Can’t we just be friends?” conversations to full on sexual assaults. I assure you, at this point I can spot a harasser from blocks away, my intuition has become so strong. (And by the way, Anonymous, that doesn’t make me “damaged goods.” How dare you refer to victims of harassment in such a fashion.)

    Last weekend, I was standing at a bus stop in Bethesda by myself, mid day, waiting to head into the city. I had my headphones in– A tactic I’ve developed as a way of tuning out harassing comments that inevitably fly at my from cars whenever I wait at a bus stop alone. Out of my peripheral vision, I noticed a man slowly approaching me, smiling, trying to get my attention. I was looking down, so I pretended that I didn’t see him or hear him. But he kept saying, “Hello, hello?”

    –And inevitably, my “polite female” conditioning kicked in. I thought to myself, “Wait, what if he simply needs directions or simple help in some other way?”

    I looked up, and he looked very pleasant and innocent, shy almost. Basically, he looked kind of like “a typical human being trying, to the best of his ability, to be friendly to someone he didn’t know.” He looked like he was probably “just a nerd” trying to talk to me.

    He introduced himself, and said that he’d seen me many times at the bus stop, and always wanted to come by and say hello, but that he was very shy. My guard immediately went up, I said hello, and then went back to my ipod.

    But he continued: He said that he was kind of shy, but that he wanted to know if we could be friends. I told him that I had a boyfriend (1. a lie, and 2, I shouldn’t have felt obligated to give him a reason, but I’m conditioned to think I should). The conversation continued like this:

    Him: “Oh, but I just want to be friends with you. I’d like to take you out to dinner and maybe see a movie and get to know you as a friend.”
    Me: “I’m sorry, but no thank you.”
    Him: “What is your name?”
    Me: “Sara.” (–A lie, of course.)
    Him: “But you seem very nice, and every time I have seen you, I have thought oh, she is such an attractive woman (now he is motioning at my body), and I would like to get to know her.”
    Me: “I’m sorry, I’m not comfortable with that. And I have a boyfriend.”
    Him: “Oh that’s okay, it can be just between us.”
    Me: “I’m sorry, but I don’t keep secrets from my boyfriend.”
    Him: “But he doesn’t have to be upset, because we can just be friends. I know that you live around here, because I’ve seen you stand here every day, and I work around here just across the street. I work just over there doing landscaping, and I see you every day as I work (as he points toward what is a heavily-wooded business lawn across the street). You are so close that I could just come over to your house at lunch time and we could order food or maybe watch a movie. Just as friends.”
    Me: “I’m sorry, but no, it’s out of the question.”
    Him: “But I am a very nice friend. I’d like to be your friend. I’d like to have your phone number.”
    Me: (Now desperate for any tactic to get him to leave:) “Look, I’m moving to CA in 2 weeks, so I won’t really live here much longer anyway, so there’s no point to us becoming friends.”
    Him: “Oh, if you are only here 2 more weeks, then please let me come meet you at your house for lunch or let me take you to dinner. Because I think you are very attractive and I’d like to get to know you before you move away.”
    Me: (Now even more desperate for a tactic that will work:) “How about this: You can give me your phone number. If I change my mind, I will call you. Okay?”

    –Of course, that wasn’t okay. The conversation continued in this fashion for about 5 more minutes until I was saved by the bus. He continued to very “innocently” push for me to give him my phone number and agree to meet up with him.

    Now, to E. and Anonymous: This I can tell you for sure– I don’t really think this man was a “creepy rapist.” I believe that he was attracted to me and trying to get a date from me, but “obviously he was doing it in the wrong way.” He was a nice enough man trying to talk to a stranger. He was probably a bit of a nerd.


    Now: While the person who posted this story did not have the 15 minute incident I did, I can almost promise you that if she’d taken the “polite girl” approach like I had, she would have experienced the same thing I did. He would not have let up. He would have stood there trying to find ways to convince her to be his “friend” or give him her number. (He already began trying to convince her after she’d said no the first time.)

    It is menacing, it is exhausting, and it is ultimately a mild form of bullying, even if the harasser simply wants to get to know us.

    Let’s take it a step further: You both seem to think that the man who approached this poster sincerely wanted to make a new friend. In my experience, men don’t want to simply make friends with a random person they don’t know, they want to “make friends” with random females they think are attractive. I don’t know what this poster looks like, but I’m going to guess that her physical appearance appealed to this man, which is what motivated him to approach her. FRIENDSHIP, platonic friendship, is NOT what motivates men to approach a woman, a stranger, who they find attractive. SEX does.

    The man who wouldn’t leave me alone at the bus stop didn’t want to be my friend. He wanted to have sex with me. Ultimately, he just did. Let’s be frank. Did he want to screw me right there at the bus stop? Perhaps not. Did the man in this story want to screw this poster right there with the dog? No. But either way, on an underlying level, these men approached us out of sexual desire, not a desire for friendship.


    So when they try to talk us out of our “no” answers (which in and of itself is outrageous), using the line that they just want to be friends, they are not only lying, but they are manipulating us by putting us in the position of looking like mean bitches if we essentially have to say “I don’t want to be your friend. I don’t know you, but I don’t want to be your friend.”

    –Sounds mean, right? We’re constantly put in the position of having to “seemingly” reject men like this based on not wanting to be their friends, which makes us look snotty. The reality is that we are not snotty, we simply know it’s not friendship they are looking for.

    We are not stupid, either. We deal with this CONSTANTLY. That you can’t understand why this woman would have had her guard up immediately when approached by this “friend-seeker” is utterly baffling.

    I admire the way this poster handled her situation. She is no doubt tired of walking her dog, standing at bus stops, or going anywhere in public and having to endure 15 minute long negotiations with men who “just want to be friends,” and so she has found a different tactic.

    –Which evidently worked.

    Congrats to her indeed.

    *P.S. E. and Anonymous: Maybe this will help you understand even further why we eventually become skeptical of any man who approaches as “friends”: Let’s give my harasser the benefit of the doubt and say that he was indeed just a nerd, not looking for sex, and simply had a shy and awkward way of making friends. Consider for a moment what he has communicated to me within the first few minutes of talking to me, a strange woman all by herself on the street:
    1)You turn me on sexually.
    2)I know where you live.
    3)I’ve been watching you from behind the trees, though you haven’t seen me.
    4)You don’t know me, but I’d like to come into your home when your boyfriend isn’t there and spend time with you alone.

    –Even if this man turned out to indeed just be entirely clueless and seeking friendship, those mere 4 comments above were enough to not only make me question his motives, but they were, especially when combined, enough to scare me senseless as I stood there alone on a street corner surrounded by wooded corners.

    The next time a man approaches me wanting to be my friend, I absolutely intend to use the tactic that the woman who posted this story did. Period.*

    • Golden Silence

      B., you stated your points eloquently. Talk about using the Gavin de Becker “Gift of Fear” there. That guy sounded like a creepy stalker. That guy obviously wasn’t looking for a platonic relationship.